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Boxing Boards => Worldwide Boxing Discussion => Topic started by: wbamitch on October 30, 2017, 10:19:47 PM



Title: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: wbamitch on October 30, 2017, 10:19:47 PM
The biggest fight globally by a distance, lots of talk about it. Makes Joshua huge in America, Wilder needs it more to get him more appeal on a whole we think?

Joshua got this one out the way which is what it was all about. Wilder is up against Stiverne again this weekend, probably his toughest opponent since Stiverne first time round. Ideally he comes through impressively, I will say it was probably his best performance in the first fight where he showed a bit of quality although Stiverne was poor.

Joshua, very much the star is looking at 3 fights next year, it seems we're looking at this as the second one in the Summer. The idea seems to be Wilder coming over for a Whyte fight which would introduce many to him, can we avoid this one being PPV or is that a certainty?

Who do we want to see Joshua in with next, Joshua has mentioned mandatory obligations but his clear long term goal being the belts. I like the idea of Joshua fighting in America, Miller seems the go to guy, seems very fitting a Wilder fight in the UK against our secondary guy and Joshua doing the same, maybe sticking to successive weeks or a double header even.

The higher risk fight against Parker for the WBO, Haye will be back in the picture if he beats Bellew.

What does everybody want, how would you like it built, is this definately a stadium fight in the UK or can it be as big in the US?  


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: AO88 on October 30, 2017, 10:30:17 PM
For me Wilder is absolute pants and is the strongest evidence going to suggest this current HW crop is not all that the TV people and casuals think it is.

Joshua losing to him damages his career far more than beating him strengthens it.

Says a lot when Wilder is reluctant to even fight Dillian Why're.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: jaff_no1 on October 31, 2017, 06:34:32 AM
Aj will fight his wba mandatory next then I think he will target Parker (If he still has his belt).

I can see why wilder wouldn't want to face dillian whyte. He isn't very good for starters and isn't known in the states. Plus if he comes over here, as I said in another thread, there is a very good chance he may be screwed by the judges


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: legs on October 31, 2017, 08:56:23 AM
Makes better sense to make sure Wilder gets the nod over in the UK to set up the Joshua fight surely?

I'd like to see Joshua go for Parker next & then Wilder but i'm not sure that is how it will work out it might be Pulev next.

Whyte isn't all that good if honest he is living off the punch that rocked Joshua he was poor against Chisora and wasn't great Saturday even though he did win it easily in the end.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: jaff_no1 on October 31, 2017, 09:20:47 AM
Makes better sense to make sure Wilder gets the nod over in the UK to set up the Joshua fight surely?

I'd like to see Joshua go for Parker next & then Wilder but i'm not sure that is how it will work out it might be Pulev next.

Whyte isn't all that good if honest he is living off the punch that rocked Joshua he was poor against Chisora and wasn't great Saturday even though he did win it easily in the end.
I think Eddie would be happy to make AJ v Whyte 2 as would still sell a stadium out and would have to pay Whyte a lot less than WIlder


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: Faulks on October 31, 2017, 09:53:29 AM
I think Eddie would be happy to make AJ v Whyte 2 as would still sell a stadium out and would have to pay Whyte a lot less than WIlder

Agree


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: legs on October 31, 2017, 10:02:12 AM
I think Eddie would be happy to make AJ v Whyte 2 as would still sell a stadium out and would have to pay Whyte a lot less than WIlder

Yeah that's true as Whyte would take that fight for probably half I was thinking more on the PPV lines it would get more casuals involved if both are unbeaten and they see the KO percentage.

Either way Eddie cannot lose provided Wilder comes through his fight Saturday night.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: The Hurricane on October 31, 2017, 10:07:52 AM
I think most of all Wilder needs to look good against Stiverne this weekend.  Neither Parker nor Whyte have generated much in the way of excitement in their fights recently so Wilder could do with putting some spark back into the mix.

Ultimately, Wilder needs to accept that he is B-side here.  At best he'll be doing 5-7k at the Barclays Centre which just can't compete with what AJ is generating.  I imagine that one of the casino's might stump up the cash to have the fight in the US but it would seem that AJ/Hearn will be calling the shots as Wilder doesn't have the money behind him.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: lurkyshaka on October 31, 2017, 10:46:16 AM
Hopefully the WBA mandatory situation isn't too pressing now with Ortiz popping hot, and Hearn can make the Parker fight next. Its unification and its a straight forward enough fight for me. It'll also give a gauge of whether Joshua has made the changes needed to his training routine ahead of a potential Wilder fight.

Wilder should fight Whyte in the meantime....and whoever wins that is obviously the natural opponent for Joshua.

Then if Fury does get himself back into contention then he'll also be looking for some of the action.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: The Hurricane on October 31, 2017, 11:41:06 AM
Parker's promoter is indicating that they would be interested in a March fight if they receive a 'respectable' offer.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: lurkyshaka on October 31, 2017, 02:48:03 PM
Parker's promoter is indicating that they would be interested in a March fight if they receive a 'respectable' offer.

I think that sounds like a good time.....the question is how 'respectable' an offer are they after?

Are they really interested in the fight? Or are they just looking for a kings ransom to cash out?

From his recent comments it does sound like Parker is starting to fancy his chances. Guess we'll soon see just how much when details of the negotiations start coming out.



Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: The Hurricane on October 31, 2017, 03:09:21 PM
I think that sounds like a good time.....the question is how 'respectable' an offer are they after?

Are they really interested in the fight? Or are they just looking for a kings ransom to cash out?

From his recent comments it does sound like Parker is starting to fancy his chances. Guess we'll soon see just how much when details of the negotiations start coming out.


I think there was reference to a throwaway comment from Hearn saying that no offer had been made but if it were then it would be about 20%.  For all his talk in the last few days, Parker had a great opportunity to drive his worth up for the AJ fight when he fought Fury but instead did himself no real favours. 

No doubting that 20% isn't going to make this fight but surely they can't expect more than 35% when his last fight was on YouTube in a half full arena.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: Bonters on October 31, 2017, 03:14:02 PM
Is there actually any potential gain to Joshua by trying to crack the American market?  Not sure of the potential revenues involved, but it does seem like anyone who wants to fight him will have to do so in the UK?  No bad thing in my opinion.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: legs on October 31, 2017, 03:19:58 PM
I agree Bonters the Americans need to get it in their heads that the UK can now compete financially with them on most fights & also Wilder isn't that popular in the States going by his fight purses and tickets sold.

Obviously Canelo is not likely to step foot in Britain I understand that he is huge on PPV so what makes $$$$$$ makes sense as Floyd would say.

Majority of the best heavyweights are European too but I guess in time Joshua will want to sample a fight at New York or Las Vegas.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: lurkyshaka on October 31, 2017, 03:24:46 PM
I think there was reference to a throwaway comment from Hearn saying that no offer had been made but if it were then it would be about 20%.  For all his talk in the last few days, Parker had a great opportunity to drive his worth up for the AJ fight when he fought Fury but instead did himself no real favours. 

No doubting that 20% isn't going to make this fight but surely they can't expect more than 35% when his last fight was on YouTube in a half full arena.

I agree....Parker has to understand the only thing he's really bringing to the fight at the moment is the WBO strap. I don't think Joshua looked particularly good against Takam, but Parker looked very poor against Hughie....and as you say in front of a small crowd. Parker has lost pretty much all his momentum and his stock has plummeted in recent fights.

I guess this will come down to how much value Joshua and Matchroom place on the WBO world title. The fans will have an idea of whats a fair offer and if one side is taking the p*ss. We shall see.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: lurkyshaka on October 31, 2017, 03:37:54 PM
Is there actually any potential gain to Joshua by trying to crack the American market?  Not sure of the potential revenues involved, but it does seem like anyone who wants to fight him will have to do so in the UK?  No bad thing in my opinion.

I think there is a potentially lucrative market there obviously if Matchroom can get the American's behind Joshua. There are a lot of potential PPV customers across there if they can pique their interest. And I suppose the best way to do that is to beat their best man.

The problem is Wilder doesn't really have any kind of big profile himself. So really Joshua will be breaking America on his own as opposed to really piggybacking on Wilder's profile, cus Wilder doesn't really have any....mainly because his promoter is doing a really sh*tty job.

Wilder is loud but a good talker and somewhat likeable, he can punch extremely hard, and American boxing has been starved of any decent American heavyweights for a long time. He's an easy sell for any promoter, but he's being promoted terribly.

Really it'll be down to Matchroom to build Wilder up on both sides of the pond, which is what Hearn is trying to do by getting a Wilder/Whyte fight made in the interim.

But I do think if everything went as planned, then AJ does have the 'potential' to be a cross over star in America. Obviously a lot of work to do first, but I can see a path to that.

But I certainly don't think Joshua needs to go cap in hand to the American's....not when boxing is so hot in the UK right now. The American's need to understand that we call the shots right now. I think they are starting to get that....but whether Wilder the d*ck who 'promotes' him get that is another thing.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: Faulks on October 31, 2017, 11:23:04 PM
He applied for his visa in Feb this year so obv plannin on going . Five year knock back isn't it if
You fail first hurdle ? Could be wrong on that


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: Dexter_Morgan on November 01, 2017, 07:40:35 AM
I don't really see Wilder as that big a fight if I am honest. If you hold your shape and move against Wilder then you'll eventual counter and stop him. If there is any sort of plan in place it would surely be AJ vs Parker in march with Tyson Fury fighting around the same time. You'd then think a summer fight against Wilder would be the next major step again with Tyson Fury fighting around this time with AJ Vs Fury either the end of the year start of next year.

I don't think any of them are that good tbh Fury fit and healthy is the best of a bad bunch. AJ is poor he's a big powerful guy and thats about it he's a British version of Wilder just not as wild. He wants you on the end of a jab so he can overhand right you. Simple movement and in close fighting causes him major problems that said AJ has a fantastic uppercut. AJ can get better and develop but there is a lot of clever marketing at the back of him. If I was Fury I'd fancy a clean sweep during 2018.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: Scarface on November 01, 2017, 12:21:04 PM
The biggest reason why Wilder will not want to face Joshua in the UK is the big reputation the UK is getting for premature ref stoppages.

There use to be a time where they would reiterate that the 3 knockdown rule was in effect... ect. However in the UK it looks like fights will never get that far.

If I was wilder I would steer clear of fighting in the UK. If he gets rocked by Joshua the ref will jump in and stop the fight. Nobody wants to pay money to see that.

The UK refs have ruined a lot of fights over the last few years.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: The Hurricane on November 01, 2017, 01:09:26 PM
In fairness, the three knockdown rule isn't really a thing anymore with most bodies/jurisdictions so it isn't going to be mentioned.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: Tuco on November 01, 2017, 02:18:26 PM
Tyson Fury has just stated that he's fighting Joshua next and that he's REEEEEALLY excited about it! Lol


https://m.youtube.com/watch?t=6s&v=h62CKyf4khc

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=N4Xw9FDhez8


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: Laney on November 01, 2017, 03:11:39 PM
If I was Wilder, i'd take the Whyte fight in a heart beat.

The judges shouldn't matter if he is confident and I don't think it is as bad as made out anyway.

He would get a career high pay day when there are no lucrative alternatives outside of AJ, he would make the AJ fight even bigger and he would command a higher percentage of that pot.

He has pissed about for years following winning the title - whats he got to lose? Hes in the game for the dough and all the dough is in the UK - he just needs to come and take it!


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: lurkyshaka on November 01, 2017, 04:15:28 PM
If I was Wilder, i'd take the Whyte fight in a heart beat.

The judges shouldn't matter if he is confident and I don't think it is as bad as made out anyway.

He would get a career high pay day when there are no lucrative alternatives outside of AJ, he would make the AJ fight even bigger and he would command a higher percentage of that pot.

He has pissed about for years following winning the title - whats he got to lose? Hes in the game for the dough and all the dough is in the UK - he just needs to come and take it!

Problem with Wilder is he's scared to risk the mega payday against Joshua. He figures if he hangs on long enough he'll just get the Joshua fight and the payday without gambling beforehand.  But if he was as confident as he says he is....then he could take the Whyte fight for about 4 times his previous best purse and make that mega payday against Joshua even bigger.

He simply cannot be as confident in his own abilities as he makes out....or he'd grab the payday against Whyte in a heartbeat and move on to the AJ fight.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: Laney on November 01, 2017, 04:21:48 PM
Problem with Wilder is he's scared to risk the mega payday against Joshua. He figures if he hangs on long enough he'll just get the Joshua fight and the payday without gambling beforehand.  But if he was as confident as he says he is....then he could take the Whyte fight for about 4 times his previous best purse and make that mega payday against Joshua even bigger.

He simply cannot be as confident in his own abilities as he makes out....or he'd grab the payday against Whyte in a heartbeat and move on to the AJ fight.

Hes a fighter though, I doubt he'd have the reservations himself - but just those round him perhaps?

Either way, if he has the capability to lose to Whyte, he had the capability to lose to any other top 15 heavyweight - so just take the Whyte fight in the UK for the $$$. Fastcar has said he can have the rematch if he loses for guess what? More $$$. All whilst building the inevitable AJ fight.

Any bog standard defence in the US does not contribute towards any long term plan that I can see? Hes been doing that for 2 years and his profile is arguably lower than it was post Stivernne?


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: Dexter_Morgan on November 01, 2017, 04:29:32 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCyvyTUDJsM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCyvyTUDJsM)

He's boxed in the UK before.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: lurkyshaka on November 01, 2017, 04:32:40 PM
Hes a fighter though, I doubt he'd have the reservations himself - but just those round him perhaps?

Either way, if he has the capability to lose to Whyte, he had the capability to lose to any other top 15 heavyweight - so just take the Whyte fight in the UK for the $$$. Fastcar has said he can have the rematch if he loses for guess what? More $$$. All whilst building the inevitable AJ fight.

Any bog standard defence in the US does not contribute towards any long term plan that I can see? Hes been doing that for 2 years and his profile is arguably lower than it was post Stivernne?

Think he just wants to ride that WBC title to the AJ shot because he knows that Joshua wants all the belts...

I agree with what you 're saying.....its frustrating because logically he should just take the Whyte fight.

You could be right about those around him....I do think that d*ckhead DiBella is playing his part in stunting developments as the moment. And with him its just about ego and not wanting to acknowledge that British boxing rule the roost at the moment and he and his fighter 'need' to travel. Can see with his recent comments about Hearn that DiBella's feathers have been ruffled and he's acting like a bit of a b*tch.

Hopefully common sense prevails in the end.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: lurkyshaka on November 01, 2017, 04:33:43 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCyvyTUDJsM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCyvyTUDJsM)

He's boxed in the UK before.

Different then though....now he thinks he's made it. And to a degree he has as long as he's got that WBC bargaining chip.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: The_Answer on November 01, 2017, 05:04:16 PM
Problem with Wilder is he's scared to risk the mega payday against Joshua. He figures if he hangs on long enough he'll just get the Joshua fight and the payday without gambling beforehand.  But if he was as confident as he says he is....then he could take the Whyte fight for about 4 times his previous best purse and make that mega payday against Joshua even bigger.

He simply cannot be as confident in his own abilities as he makes out....or he'd grab the payday against Whyte in a heartbeat and move on to the AJ fight.

That's abit unfair considering he was set to fight Povetkin in Russia not so long back before getting cheated out of it. Then he was set to fight Ortiz before again getting cheated out of it. It's easy to say he's not taking risks, but his record would of had a completely different look come Monday if it wasn't for cheats.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: lurkyshaka on November 01, 2017, 05:28:26 PM
That's abit unfair considering he was set to fight Povetkin in Russia not so long back before getting cheated out of it. Then he was set to fight Ortiz before again getting cheated out of it. It's easy to say he's not taking risks, but his record would of had a completely different look come Monday if it wasn't for cheats.

Fair enough, I did think about that. But that just makes his reluctance to fight Whyte all the more puzzling.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: Dexter_Morgan on November 01, 2017, 05:36:59 PM
Different then though....now he thinks he's made it. And to a degree he has as long as he's got that WBC bargaining chip.

Of course he's made it he's a World Heavyweight champion. He might not have made it in super fight sense however like has just been said he's been signed to fight decent fighters and they have fallen through. Dillian Whyte doesn't have a profile stateside and he's probably not wanting to chance fighting in the UK on a Hearn show because lets be honest there have been a few questionable results and stoppages.

If its that big of a deal why doesn't Hearn sit down and go straight for the Josuha fight?


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: The_Answer on November 01, 2017, 05:41:41 PM
Fair enough, I did think about that. But that just makes his reluctance to fight Whyte all the more puzzling.

I'm not sure about any reluctance but Ortiz is higher ranked by the WBC and is/was the better opponent in my opinion, so naturally that was the fight to make.

Other than that with Wilder's ego he won't jump through any hoops to fight Joshua and nor should he have to.. it's the fight to make.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: lurkyshaka on November 01, 2017, 07:29:10 PM
I'm not sure about any reluctance but Ortiz is higher ranked by the WBC and is/was the better opponent in my opinion, so naturally that was the fight to make.

Other than that with Wilder's ego he won't jump through any hoops to fight Joshua and nor should he have to.. it's the fight to make.

I had no issue with the Ortiz fight....shame that one fell through.
But if Joshua takes on Parker, I don't see why Wilder is adverse to fighting Whyte in the meantime for a career high payday.





Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: AO88 on November 01, 2017, 09:01:57 PM
I had no issue with the Ortiz fight....shame that one fell through.
But if Joshua takes on Parker, I don't see why Wilder is adverse to fighting Whyte in the meantime for a career high payday.





Because he's pants and he knows he might lose to Whyte and then the even bigger Joshua payday.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: lurkyshaka on November 01, 2017, 09:52:54 PM
Because he's pants and he knows he might lose to Whyte and then the even bigger Joshua payday.

Yeah that's what I sort of think....Wilder doesn't have as much confidence as he likes to portray and something about Dillian Whyte gives him the jitters.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: ScottMillwall on November 02, 2017, 01:19:53 PM
Why doesn't Hearn make Parker fight an eliminator to fight Joshua? It's absolutely ridiculous that the WBC heavyweight champion of the world should fight Dillian Whyte (whose best win is Helenius) to get a chance to fight Joshua. It's clearly because he poses a real threat.

Also, Lou DiBella ain't holding things up. He's merely a mouthpiece for Haymon.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: lurkyshaka on November 02, 2017, 03:05:29 PM
Why doesn't Hearn make Parker fight an eliminator to fight Joshua? It's absolutely ridiculous that the WBC heavyweight champion of the world should fight Dillian Whyte (whose best win is Helenius) to get a chance to fight Joshua. It's clearly because he poses a real threat.

Also, Lou DiBella ain't holding things up. He's merely a mouthpiece for Haymon.

I think the reason Hearn wants Wilder/Whyte to happen first is because he thinks it'll add value to Joshua/Wilder if the American can beat a fighter that the British PPV casuals know......and if Whyte pulled off the upset then great because a rematch would Joshua would naturally be big business.

Parker for his part.....did come to the UK to defend against Fury, albeit he looked terrible.

Joshua/Wilder could happen anytime now, but it could be made considerably bigger and that's what Hearn has an eye on.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: jaff_no1 on November 02, 2017, 05:08:46 PM
Why doesn't Hearn make Parker fight an eliminator to fight Joshua? It's absolutely ridiculous that the WBC heavyweight champion of the world should fight Dillian Whyte (whose best win is Helenius) to get a chance to fight Joshua. It's clearly because he poses a real threat.

Also, Lou DiBella ain't holding things up. He's merely a mouthpiece for Haymon.
Spot on.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: Dexter_Morgan on November 02, 2017, 08:51:16 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/boxing/article-5042073/Anthony-Joshua-vs-Deontay-Wilder-hits-stumbling-block.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/boxing/article-5042073/Anthony-Joshua-vs-Deontay-Wilder-hits-stumbling-block.html)


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: lurkyshaka on November 03, 2017, 09:00:59 AM
[url]http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/boxing/article-5042073/Anthony-Joshua-vs-Deontay-Wilder-hits-stumbling-block.html[/url] ([url]http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/boxing/article-5042073/Anthony-Joshua-vs-Deontay-Wilder-hits-stumbling-block.html[/url])


WBC causing trouble again......6th and 12th fight each other and it serves as a final eliminator, they make the rules up as they go along. They don't want unification.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: The Hurricane on November 03, 2017, 09:52:27 AM
I still wouldn't be surprised to see Whyte end up as Wilder's mandatory after his win on Saturday being for the Silver title.  He was at #3 in the last rankings and Stiverne will drop down if he loses on Saturday and Ortiz will be out due to his PED test failure.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: ChicagoFightFan on November 03, 2017, 10:05:09 AM
Because he's pants and he knows he might lose to Whyte and then the even bigger Joshua payday.

Wilder has tried to fight top names and they have all pissed hot for PEDís. He obviously isnít worried about testing himself against top opposition. A low risk and low reward fight is the last thing he needs after all of the criticism he has received after his first five defenses. Granted, you canít hold it against him that the sport is full of drug cheats.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: jaff_no1 on November 03, 2017, 10:08:07 AM
Wilder has tried to fight top names and they have all pissed hot for PEDís. He obviously isnít worried about testing himself against top opposition. A low risk and low reward fight is the last thing he needs after all of the criticism he has received after his first five defenses. Granted, you canít hold it against him that the sport is full of drug cheats.
I'd agree with that. Take out a 41 year old Wlad that Fury had beaten easily 18 months prior and there aren't any names on his record.

AJ has not signed to fight anyone near the calibre of Povetkin or Ortiz. I don't understand why people think Dillian Whyte is a step up from what Wilder has faced/is facing


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: The Hurricane on November 03, 2017, 10:35:04 AM
I'd agree with that. Take out a 41 year old Wlad that Fury had beaten easily 18 months prior and there aren't any names on his record.

AJ has not signed to fight anyone near the calibre of Povetkin or Ortiz. I don't understand why people think Dillian Whyte is a step up from what Wilder has faced/is facing

It's a bit disingenuous to disregard Wlad, notwithstanding he was coming off the Fury loss.  Wlad absolutely dominated Povetkin and Ortiz looked awful against Scott and Allen in back to back fights before Wilder signed to fight him.  Given the state of the division in general they weren't bad fights but in terms of calibre they are both a long way from Wlad.

I'd say Wilders handlers dropped the ball by not getting a deal done with Wlad once the wheels came off for Fury.  Allowing Eddie to get the deal done for the fight at Wembley meant Wilder was always going to behind AJ in the pecking order after he'd won.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: deck on November 04, 2017, 04:26:31 PM
Fair play to Wilder for the shape he comes in. 219lbs for a man of his height is very good. You'd be sick of the shape some heavyweights come into the ring in. They're blowing out of their hole after 3 rounds. It makes the heavyweight scene mostly very uninspiring. 

Looking forward to AJ/Wilder/Ortiz and possibly Fury.  


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: Dexter_Morgan on November 05, 2017, 06:19:23 AM
Can we put a spoiler in the thread title with last nights result becoming known?


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: deck on November 05, 2017, 09:53:31 AM
Can we put a spoiler in the thread title with last nights result becoming known?

Done


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: The_Answer on November 05, 2017, 10:02:48 AM
Just seen on post press conference Wilder & Dibella have said no issues about the UK and will fight Joshua on the moon if necessary. Balls in Eddie Hearns court now, it's the fight to be made.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder
Post by: Dexter_Morgan on November 05, 2017, 01:47:32 PM
Done

Cheers bud,


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: Dexter_Morgan on November 05, 2017, 01:53:16 PM
Based on the last two performances and taking into account styles I honestly think Wilder is all wrong for AJ, I listened to Hearn last night talking about what AJ said when he heard Wilders weight. I get the impression they are underestimating Wilder.
The way Wilder comes in will cause AJ problems he's lively quick throws from very awkward angles and he doesn't let an opponent settle.

I just can't see AJ being able to plod through the fight trying to establish the jab followed by the overhand right and doing so against Wilder in fairly straight lines. He would need to be on the money from the first bell and time this guy as he comes in and then who know's.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: deck on November 05, 2017, 01:55:07 PM
Just seen on post press conference Wilder & Dibella have said no issues about the UK and will fight Joshua on the moon if necessary. Balls in Eddie Hearns court now, it's the fight to be made.

Let's hope it's sooner ather than later. If it's not too one sided you could see modern trilogy. No need to hide for years instead of opening up more opportunities. :)


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: lurkyshaka on November 05, 2017, 04:47:38 PM
Based on the last two performances and taking into account styles I honestly think Wilder is all wrong for AJ, I listened to Hearn last night talking about what AJ said when he heard Wilders weight. I get the impression they are underestimating Wilder.
The way Wilder comes in will cause AJ problems he's lively quick throws from very awkward angles and he doesn't let an opponent settle.

I just can't see AJ being able to plod through the fight trying to establish the jab followed by the overhand right and doing so against Wilder in fairly straight lines. He would need to be on the money from the first bell and time this guy as he comes in and then who know's.

Makes AJ's weight gain all the more worrying because Wilder despite being crude and raw is fast and powerful....and if this comes down to who can pull the trigger first.......

I don't like Joshua's comments post Wilder/Stiverne on social media where he and Hearn have referenced Wilder's relatively light weight and Joshua commented that he'll eat him.....f*cks sakes if Joshua thinks a 15 st man doesn't have the power to put his lights out then he's delusional. For all his faults one thing about Wilder that can't be doubted is his punching power!

Joshua 'should' beat Wilder, he should be able to exploit the holes in Wilder and knock him out. But if he keeps coming in looking like a bodybuilder then he's increasing Wilder's chances.

Don't think this fight will happen anytime soon though.....if Wilder wanted 7 million to fight Whyte then goodness only knows what kind of cash he's going to demand to fight Joshua. I have a feeling Wilder and his camp will shout their mouths off only to price themselves out when push comes to shove. But since Hearn is pretty transparent when it comes to talking about offers made etc....I guess we'll find out whose been reasonable/unreasonable etc.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: deck on November 05, 2017, 06:12:22 PM
Makes AJ's weight gain all the more worrying because Wilder despite being crude and raw is fast and powerful....and if this comes down to who can pull the trigger first.......

I don't like Joshua's comments post Wilder/Stiverne on social media where he and Hearn have referenced Wilder's relatively light weight and Joshua commented that he'll eat him.....f*cks sakes if Joshua thinks a 15 st man doesn't have the power to put his lights out then he's delusional. For all his faults one thing about Wilder that can't be doubted is his punching power!

Joshua 'should' beat Wilder, he should be able to exploit the holes in Wilder and knock him out. But if he keeps coming in looking like a bodybuilder then he's increasing Wilder's chances.

Don't think this fight will happen anytime soon though.....if Wilder wanted 7 million to fight Whyte then goodness only knows what kind of cash he's going to demand to fight Joshua. I have a feeling Wilder and his camp will shout their mouths off only to price themselves out when push comes to shove. But since Hearn is pretty transparent when it comes to talking about offers made etc....I guess we'll find out whose been reasonable/unreasonable etc.

Do you think that's purely based on cash or not wanting the fight?


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: The_Answer on November 05, 2017, 06:42:31 PM
Makes AJ's weight gain all the more worrying because Wilder despite being crude and raw is fast and powerful....and if this comes down to who can pull the trigger first.......

I don't like Joshua's comments post Wilder/Stiverne on social media where he and Hearn have referenced Wilder's relatively light weight and Joshua commented that he'll eat him.....f*cks sakes if Joshua thinks a 15 st man doesn't have the power to put his lights out then he's delusional. For all his faults one thing about Wilder that can't be doubted is his punching power!

Joshua 'should' beat Wilder, he should be able to exploit the holes in Wilder and knock him out. But if he keeps coming in looking like a bodybuilder then he's increasing Wilder's chances.

Don't think this fight will happen anytime soon though.....if Wilder wanted 7 million to fight Whyte then goodness only knows what kind of cash he's going to demand to fight Joshua. I have a feeling Wilder and his camp will shout their mouths off only to price themselves out when push comes to shove. But since Hearn is pretty transparent when it comes to talking about offers made etc....I guess we'll find out whose been reasonable/unreasonable etc.

It works both ways.. Hearn is just as likely to make Joshua v Bellew if Haye's body doesn't hold together enough than arrange the Wilder fight.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: lurkyshaka on November 05, 2017, 07:38:26 PM
Do you think that's purely based on cash or not wanting the fight?

I just think Wilder has a very inflated opinion of his worth. I think he fancies the fight but he'll be excessively greedy in negotiations and want a much bigger slice of the pie than his current worth warrants. Its whether Joshua and Hearn are prepared to overpay. How much is that WBC title worth to them? And how much are they prepared to overpay considering that Wilder is also a dangerous fight too?


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: lurkyshaka on November 05, 2017, 07:41:29 PM
It works both ways.. Hearn is just as likely to make Joshua v Bellew if Haye's body doesn't hold together enough than arrange the Wilder fight.

That fight will never happen......Bellew would never fight Joshua, no way no how. He's said it many times and he simply doesn't need money enough at this point to just look for a payday in a fight he doesn't fancy.

Haye on the other hand is a possible option should he beat Bellew. That fight would sell.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: deck on November 05, 2017, 07:52:29 PM
I just think Wilder has a very inflated opinion of his worth. I think he fancies the fight but he'll be excessively greedy in negotiations and want a much bigger slice of the pie than his current worth warrants. Its whether Joshua and Hearn are prepared to overpay. How much is that WBC title worth to them? And how much are they prepared to overpay considering that Wilder is also a dangerous fight too?

You'd think that both sides should feel the pressure to make the fight.

Every other era made the defining fights of the time. The heavyweight scene isn't exactly awash with talent and they're already out of other people to fight.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: lurkyshaka on November 05, 2017, 08:28:39 PM
You'd think that both sides should feel the pressure to make the fight.

Every other era made the defining fights of the time. The heavyweight scene isn't exactly awash with talent and they're already out of other people to fight.

Lewis/Bowe fell by the wayside because the American didn't fancy it.

I do think though that Wilder fancies his chances, its just how realistic will he be when it comes to negotiations.....but him wanting 7 million to fight Whyte isn't a promising omen.

Really both should be falling over themselves to get to Parker first and strengthen their position. That is especially true for Wilder, if he could get his hands on that WBO strap then his position would be bolstered massively. Perhaps we'll see a bidding war for a Parker fight get underway.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: The Hurricane on November 05, 2017, 09:28:29 PM
After his display against Fury Iím not sure Parker adds a huge amount now. Obviously it would be good to see a fight for the undisputed heavyweight championship but as things stand I donít think a win over Parker really ups the interest in AJ v Wilder at all.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: lurkyshaka on November 06, 2017, 08:33:18 AM
After his display against Fury Iím not sure Parker adds a huge amount now. Obviously it would be good to see a fight for the undisputed heavyweight championship but as things stand I donít think a win over Parker really ups the interest in AJ v Wilder at all.

The win not so much, Parker has looked poor for 3 consecutive fights now.....but the WBO belt does matter.
That's Parker's bargaining chip and he knows it.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: ChicagoFightFan on November 07, 2017, 11:41:49 AM
Considering how much Stiverne was able to absorb in the first fight, the last performance by Wilder was impressive in that sense. He canít be blamed for his opponent showing up and looking like a fat f*ck.

If there is someone to expose Wilderís flaws and make him look ordinary, it would be Joshua. Still would love to see the fight though, because Wilder has that equalizer with his power and speed.

Could see it playing out like Hearns vs Hagler I. Wilder taking on the Hearns role and shooting everything in the first round. If he fails to make a dent, it would be tough to picture anything other than a Joshua win. Also huge chance of Wilder breaking his hand again against such a massive fighter like Joshua. To his credit, he has still thrown with relative power after obliterating his hand in past fights.

I think most of us would agree that this fight should be made. I think there will be enough money to make it happen. Might take one more fight each, but it can happen.


Title: Re: Building Joshua vs Wilder **Wilder v Stiverne SPOILER**
Post by: Dexter_Morgan on November 10, 2017, 08:27:19 AM
https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/1817484/anthony-joshua-promoter-eddie-hearn-confirms-deontay-wilder-unification-fight-will-happen-in-2018-with-talks-starting-now/ (https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/1817484/anthony-joshua-promoter-eddie-hearn-confirms-deontay-wilder-unification-fight-will-happen-in-2018-with-talks-starting-now/)