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[deck]

At the end of the day

B Level fighters = Average to good fighters
A level fighters = Elite fighters , worldclass per attributes

Ward fits in the A level as Froch in the B level.

We soon will find out what both these men have to offer but i will say this ... To become a A level fighter, u need to adjust well and be a complete fighter. Froch will struggle with the adjustments that need to be made in this fight .

So you don't consider Froch to be world class?

I think that Froch is capable of change and performing excellently in terms of boxing. His fight against Abraham(and I'm not getting into the middleweight arguement) showed that he has very good boxing skills when he uses them. His problem can be that he doesn't always follow the gameplan properly. When he does he is very effective however.

I don't think Carl underestimates Ward in any way and I think that he will follow the plan and advice in the corner of his very astute trainer because he wants this win so much. I think it will bring out the best in Carl and he will give it 100%. I don't feel it will be an easy fight for either fighter - no matter how it turns out.

[MadMariner]

At the end of the day

B Level fighters = Average to good fighters
A level fighters = Elite fighters , worldclass per attributes

Ward fits in the A level as Froch in the B level.

We soon will find out what both these men have to offer but i will say this ... To become a A level fighter, u need to adjust well and be a complete fighter. Froch will struggle with the adjustments that need to be made in this fight .

Where do you place Heart and Will to Win in there Keegan.   I think  this one may surprise you 

[Keegan Jacobs]

So you don't consider Froch to be world class?

I think that Froch is capable of change and performing excellently in terms of boxing. His fight against Abraham(and I'm not getting into the middleweight arguement) showed that he has very good boxing skills when he uses them. His problem can be that he doesn't always follow the gameplan properly. When he does he is very effective however.

I don't think Carl underestimates Ward in any way and I think that he will follow the plan and advice in the corner of his very astute trainer because he wants this win so much. I think it will bring out the best in Carl and he will give it 100%. I don't feel it will be an easy fight for either fighter - no matter how it turns out.

Froch world class ?  Deck i have always respected you on all your posts but this might be your bad day .  
We might have a different definition on world class .

Froch is a good fighter who brings excitement and power but if you put in a very good pure boxer that will neutralize your strengths , its up to Froch to then adjust .
Do i think the only way Froch can win this fight is by a punch that lands flush ? Yes but will it happen ? Small percentage .

Do i think Ward will show Froch different angles, different punch combinations, different stances , different rythem all together ?  Yes which will make Froch look slow and off target .

Deck , don't be shocked when Ward makes it a easy fight and i will just prey that a cut doesnt happen to change a fight around .

[Gavin]

Deck , don't be shocked when Ward makes it a easy fight and i will just prey that a cut doesnt happen to change a fight around .

Ward better leave his swede out the way of Carls then!

[Keegan Jacobs]

Where do you place Heart and Will to Win in there Keegan.   I think  this one may surprise you  

aaahhhh good point Mariner . I actually thought about heart before i posted and not to discredit Froch in this category since he has tremendous heart .

I might get tomatoes thrown at me for this but i feel WARD has equal heart so nobody gets the reward . Now i know Froch's heart has been tested more than Ward but that to me just means he's been on the canvas more or has been hit more than Andre.

We can't say Ward doesnt have the heart just because he doesnt get hit as much or gets up from the canvas than Carl .

Ward is a special fighter that doesnt back down when he gets hit , in fact he fights back just like Mayweather Jr  who has a huge heart .

Nice post Mariner 

[deck]

Froch world class ?  Deck i have always respected you on all your posts but this might be your bad day .  
We might have a different definition on world class .

Froch is a good fighter who brings excitement and power but if you put in a very good pure boxer that will neutralize your strengths , its up to Froch to then adjust .
Do i think the only way Froch can win this fight is by a punch that lands flush ? Yes but will it happen ? Small percentage .

Do i think Ward will show Froch different angles, different punch combinations, different stances , different rythem all together ?  Yes which will make Froch look slow and off target .

Deck , don't be shocked when Ward makes it a easy fight and i will just prey that a cut doesnt happen to change a fight around .

There's a difference between world class and elite. Froch has taken on many of the best fighters at his weight and fighters who have won world titles before and after they fought him and won. He's only lost one close fight. I think it's a bit disrespectful, considering who he's shared a ring with to this stage to say he is just average to good in terms of being a fighter.

Froch has said that it is up to him to cut down the ring on Ward. I don't think for a minute he thinks Ward will stand there in front of him. He knows that he'll either be elusive or right on him at any given time and trying to minimise the time spent in the middle distance. They will have been working on trying to neutralise those assets of Ward's themselves. That is easier said than done but not impossible.

[Keegan Jacobs]

There's a difference between world class and elite. Froch has taken on many of the best fighters at his weight and fighters who have won world titles before and after they fought him and won. He's only lost one close fight. I think it's a bit disrespectful, considering who he's shared a ring with to this stage to say he is just average to good in terms of being a fighter.

Froch has said that it is up to him to cut down the ring on Ward. I don't think for a minute he thinks Ward will stand there in front of him. He knows that he'll either be elusive or right on him at any given time and trying to minimise the time spent in the middle distance. They will have been working on trying to neutralise those assets of Ward's themselves. That is easier said than done but not impossible.

ahh ok thats where we don't see eye to eye because i have elite and world class as 1 . I don't know deck,  hope i'm wrong to make it an interesting fight but all the fights i have seen froch in ,  I haven't been impressed . Sidesteps and angles by the opposition would open up their countering game,  and will get Froch in trouble since his punches are wide and his upright position stance just makes it worse for him since the lack of elusiveness he presents,  makes his face an easy target.

[MadMariner]

Keegan

Ward reminds me in a way of Mayweather and that does scare me  it's almost like December 2007 again my eyes.  But the difference is Ward will not be able to adapt as quick as FMJ and is untested in the trenches whilst Floyd had already come through some very difficult fights as in Castillo and Oscar.

I hope cuts are not an issue in the fight  do not want the tournament to end like that

May the best man win

WAR COBRA

[Keegan Jacobs]

Keegan

Ward reminds me in a way of Mayweather and that does scare me  it's almost like December 2007 again my eyes.  But the difference is Ward will not be able to adapt as quick as FMJ and is untested in the trenches whilst Floyd had already come through some very difficult fights as in Castillo and Oscar.

I hope cuts are not an issue in the fight  do not want the tournament to end like that

May the best man win

WAR COBRA

Yes good point Mariner. Here's a CC even though those don't mean much from me .
FMJ does adapt quickly and lets just hope the same with Ward but yes i have realized he adjusts late rather than early .

Yup you got it Mariner, let the best man win .

TEAM WARD 

[motoriser]

well clearly i dont need to as iv had sticthes without pain relief....somthing andre couldnt have...

still that does not vindicate any of your theories that don't hold any water at all.
The cut was deep,you just have painted eyes.
He was cut against Edison Miranda early,and still kept his composure and schooled the guy with the cut.
Its completely different getting cut in sparring when preparing for a career defining fights,so hence all the mood swings etc.
Again its pointless explaining this to you coz you and many others here have an agenda and that's all about clutching at straws all day.

The best part about it is Froch and Ward will eventually get in the Ring in December and you will be singing another sad Tune after Froch drops his WBC title to the guy you love to hate.
Have a nice day.  

[motoriser]

Keegan

Ward reminds me in a way of Mayweather and that does scare me  it's almost like December 2007 again my eyes.  But the difference is Ward will not be able to adapt as quick as FMJ and is untested in the trenches whilst Floyd had already come through some very difficult fights as in Castillo and Oscar.

I hope cuts are not an issue in the fight  do not want the tournament to end like that

May the best man win

WAR COBRA

Very well put.CC

[Jambonhead]

can i make somthing clear to keegan and motorisor, and you can dredge up my old posts to confirm this

im not saying ward wont beat froch, i think ward will box a cynical, clinical fight nicking the fight on points and spoiling whenever he feels threatened. I fullly expect ward to walk away with a decision win

However this does not mean I like him or respect him for this, the guy just grinds my gears, what else can i say. He tries to come across as some god fearing bible bashing holy guy but simultaneously disrespects his god and other people by claiming god has chosen him to be a great boxer and shit on others.

He claims to be this good guy, whilst simultaneously using some of the worst rough house tactics ive seen from modern fighters. He is boring as hell inside the ring and even more dull outside. He models himself on FMJ but only does the safety first things and concrete fundamentals, he doesnt have the style or flare of mayweather.

He gets on my nerves anyway, but like i said i fully expect him to win on dec 17th. I would be suprised and over-joyed if froch pulls it off, similar to the groves-degale fight.

This drama about getting cut and having a meltdown and being a massive drama queen just pissed me off even more, then bitching to his own kids saying ''no it didnt hurt son, but the shots did'' F*ck off, hes a pro boxer and bitching to his OWN kids about some injections....maybe its a different way of bringing up children over there but my male family members would never admit to being hurt even if they really did hurt themselves...

maybe its just a culture thing or something, but i cant relate to andre ward and he just seems to perfectly annoy the hell out of me, its hard to explain but im sure others on here can relate to what im saying

[King Cotto]

can i make somthing clear to keegan and motorisor, and you can dredge up my old posts to confirm this

im not saying ward wont beat froch, i think ward will box a cynical, clinical fight nicking the fight on points and spoiling whenever he feels threatened. I fullly expect ward to walk away with a decision win

However this does not mean I like him or respect him for this, the guy just grinds my gears, what else can i say. He tries to come across as some god fearing bible bashing holy guy but simultaneously disrespects his god and other people by claiming god has chosen him to be a great boxer and shit on others.

He claims to be this good guy, whilst simultaneously using some of the worst rough house tactics ive seen from modern fighters. He is boring as hell inside the ring and even more dull outside. He models himself on FMJ but only does the safety first things and concrete fundamentals, he doesnt have the style or flare of mayweather.

He gets on my nerves anyway, but like i said i fully expect him to win on dec 17th. I would be suprised and over-joyed if froch pulls it off, similar to the groves-degale fight.

This drama about getting cut and having a meltdown and being a massive drama queen just pissed me off even more, then bitching to his own kids saying ''no it didnt hurt son, but the shots did'' F*ck off, hes a pro boxer and bitching to his OWN kids about some injections....maybe its a different way of bringing up children over there but my male family members would never admit to being hurt even if they really did hurt themselves...

maybe its just a culture thing or something, but i cant relate to andre ward and he just seems to perfectly annoy the hell out of me, its hard to explain but im sure others on here can relate to what im saying

IQ

[Keegan Jacobs]

sorry u feel that way Jambonhead .

Andre is polite, friendly, humble, and a great guy to hang out with . My friend always goes to his boxing gym in Oakland for interview and he has always given him 2 tickets for his fights at Oakland but i never go . Dont ask me why , i just dont like to leave my son and my wife home alone while i go out of town to watch a fight .

He will tell you exactly how he feels on anything that is on your mind .

We asked him about the kessler fight , and he was so happy that his first fight in the super 6 against kessler was at oakland . he was not sure on the results if he fought in a different country but also mentioned to be great , one day he will have to fight outside the US.

[loughboroughred]

sorry u feel that way Jambonhead .

Andre is polite, friendly, humble, and a great guy to hang out with . My friend always goes to his boxing gym in Oakland for interview and he has always given him 2 tickets for his fights at Oakland but i never go . Dont ask me why , i just dont like to leave my son and my wife home alone while i go out of town to watch a fight .

He will tell you exactly how he feels on anything that is on your mind .

We asked him about the kessler fight , and he was so happy that his first fight in the super 6 against kessler was at oakland . he was not sure on the results if he fought in a different country but also mentioned to be great , one day he will have to fight outside the US.

 Funny you should mention that because you seem to make out that Wards 0 shows hes a better fighter than Froch whos only defeat was in Denmark to Kess after some serious disruptions.

 Tell me, what date changes, venue changes and ash clouds did Ward have to contend with?

 I'm not making excuses but maybe you should take a leaf out of your heroes book and admit when he's been fortunate.