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[Aaron]

That is very true, boxing would be shit. However we live in a world where calzaghe is slated for fighting old man hopkins years ago instead of fighting froch. Froch would have given his left tit to face hopkins back then and now.

Not sure on that, I think the only time Carl would like to face Hopkins is if it happened over here. In the states Nard does not sell the tickets and his style is anything but ideal for any fighter.

Hopkins was not such a huge appeal back then really, his two losses to Taylor put a huge shadow over him that the Winky Wright fight did little to shift. Beating a bigger but faded Tarver was never going to amaze people with him again.

Regardless of how people rate Pascal that to now stands to be Hopkins biggest win in sometime, Pascal was fresh of beating america's next thing in Chad Dawson and many thought he would just be too young, hungry and fresh for the old man. The domination in the second fight and press ups' inbetween rounds got Hopkins talked about more than any fight he has had for years from what I recall, in addition to that he became the oldest world champ of all time.

Dawson had the best chance to get a win over Hopkins in years but due to the shoulder he lost it, I doubt with the time out Nard will take he will get the same praise second time around as he would of first time.

I would love to see Hopkins fight live just because of who he is and what he has done and represents, but only I and most keen boxing fans would feel like that and not the casuals.

[styledoctor]

Against a Boxer like Hopkins he did not do anything special to show adaptation.
He could not hurt the guy,he just threw aimless flurries that Manny Steward described as Amateurish coz they were not even landing.With the Crowd on his side,the judges were swayed into giving him rounds in which he did not do anything with substance.
Bhop's Ignorant comments before the fight worked against him and he should have won that fight,even Joe's father told him in the final round that he has to score a knockout or else he will lose.He did not stop him and should have lost,but he MILKED it.
A Prime Athletic Ward who even has a better Amateur Pedigree that shits all over Calzaghe's.Also Ward won his first World Title with less fights and had to defeat a reigning Champion instead of a weight drained former Champion who took the fight at 2 weeks notice.
Ward only took 2 years to Unify,unlike No show Joe who took a whopping 9 years !, plus Ward has not faced anywhere near as many Bums as Joe has done.
You won't see Ward rematching Shelby Pudwill like how Joe re matched Veit.
Joe Slappie's Greatness is padded with a capital P.

Always an excuse to denigrate Calzaghe isn't there? Kessler was injured. BHop was old. Lacy was a hype job. Brewer was crap. Mitchell couldn't punch. Fact is he passed every test over 15 years as a pro. Come back when your poster boy Ward has done anything like that.

Greatness is also about sustained performance and longevity. You or some other muppet was on here talking about Devon Alexander as the new Sugar Ray Leonard. You or some other muppet was on here talking about Paul Williams as better than Tommy Hearns. You or some other muppet was on here talking about Chad Dawson like he was the second coming of Bob Foster. Absolute rubbish of the highest order. Ward is a good fighter, but his toughest tests are in front of him.

[motoriser]

They all made several successful defenses though, which is the point im making, and Joe fought them pretty much in around those periods. Mitchell took an absolute robbing from Ottke and that fight should have been for 3 world straps when Calzaghe fought him, a vastly vastly underrated win.

Just out of interest who has Ward beaten that was undefeated when he faced them then?
Kessler - beaten by Calzaghe already (made successful defenses)
Bika - the same
Green - No better than Lacy apparently
Froch - beaten by Kessler (made successful defenses)
Abraham - no better than Green at smw.

...and people have the audacity to say hes achieved more already? Less of the bandwagon, more of the cold hard facts.

Dude,being undefeated means Jackshit when you fight a guy who has not faced anyone of note.
Hell certain fighters actually have improved after suffering a loss or losses ie Joe Louis,Sugar Ray Robinson and Pacman.What matters is who they defeat when they are at their Primes or if they have any notable names on their Resume at time of significant Bout.Ward also faced some undefeated prospects when he was coming up,but that counts for shits as they had not faced anyone of note.
The point is,Lacy was talentless stiff as his Amateur record speaks for itself,he later won a Vacant title and was always gonna lose the first time he faces a Boxer.So the fact that Joe took his 0 is not great coz Lacy was a nobody to begin with.
The Carl Froch who faced Dirrel was undefeated but the Froch who faced Abraham was the better seasoned fighter..............get the picture.
So this business of being unbeaten means jackshit especially when a fighter has not faced a notable opponent.
Only time we Rave about unbeaten records is when they have Quality names on them and numerous World Champions having been soundly defeated in the process.
In the Case of Joe,he only won a Vacant title and waited for 9 years before facing his first Champion opponent and that was paper Champion Lacy.Kessler was the second and last Champion he defeated at 168 and that was over a 10 year career.This goes to show the mediocrity of his opposition.
You can't compare it to someone who with only 20 fights faces a 2 time World Champion in his first Title shot,then defeats another Champion within a 2 year period.All title defenses were against highly ranked Challengers and not some Out of shape Milkmen.

[motoriser]

Always an excuse to denigrate Calzaghe isn't there? Kessler was injured. BHop was old. Lacy was a hype job. Brewer was crap. Mitchell couldn't punch. Fact is he passed every test over 15 years as a pro. Come back when your poster boy Ward has done anything like that.

Greatness is also about sustained performance and longevity. You or some other muppet was on here talking about Devon Alexander as the new Sugar Ray Leonard. You or some other muppet was on here talking about Paul Williams as better than Tommy Hearns. You or some other muppet was on here talking about Chad Dawson like he was the second coming of Bob Foster. Absolute rubbish of the highest order. Ward is a good fighter, but his toughest tests are in front of him.

Pretty sure You got me confused with another poster coz I was never sold on Alexander and PW.
Check my posts DATA.
Speaking of Joe,simple question is how many World Champions had he defeated at 25 pro fights?.................ANSWER is ZERO.
While the other subject of this debate has already defeated 2 Champions in 25 fights,plus a much more distinguished Amateur record.Thus why his Resume has already blitzed No Show Joe's at this stage.Its about Quality and not quantity.
No need to mention meaningless Title defenses against the Tocker Pudwills of this World.