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Author Topic: The British Boxing Board of Control Statement on Haye Chisora  (Read 1005 times)
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cocksuckinknowitall
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« Reply #15 on: May 09, 2012, 10:51:27 PM »

Kangaroo court has reached their verdict !!

Pot, met kettle. Roll Eyes
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« Reply #15 on: May 09, 2012, 10:51:27 PM »

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Chris
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« Reply #16 on: May 10, 2012, 01:40:07 AM »

I think you'll find this is called 'cutting off your nose to spite your face'

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« Reply #17 on: May 10, 2012, 06:40:28 AM »

absolute power corrupts absolutely..........   BBBoC.     Hypocrites and money grabbers each and every one of them.


   Not a fact, its just how i see them and there antics.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2012, 07:31:32 AM by Kevan2 » Logged

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« Reply #18 on: May 10, 2012, 08:57:57 AM »

I broadly agree with what the BBBoC have said here, notwithstanding that I disagreed with their decision to ban Chisora indefinitely, without a term for automatic review.

The BBBoC has made some ill advised decisions as all governing bodies do.  But in this case, Chisora was still due to have his appeal heard as part of the due process.  Whilst there have been poor decisions from Board appointed officials in fights, shipping in random officials from Board's of random countries isn't going to rectify this.  Those involved in boxing matches under the auspices of the BBBoC are fighting in one of the safest environments in the boxing world as a result the improvements the Board have made. 

I can't think I've ever heard of a fighter from Luxembourg or a fight taking place there so who knows what their rules are regarding medical provision.

I never understood the mass hissy fit that followed what happened in Munich.  It was a post fight press conference, not on the stage at a The Wiggles show.  I imagine Chisora would have had his ban confirmed for a finite amount of time on appeal and Haye could have applied for a new British licence.

It does seem to smack of desperation somewhat that ***** would risk alienating the Board to such a degree in order to stage a one off event. 
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Red
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« Reply #19 on: May 10, 2012, 09:19:41 AM »

Apparently that Baker fella, who sat representing Luxembourg at the presser, actually owns a medical / insurance company that supplies white collar and non-BBBoC shows cover.

His medics, insurances are far less to buy than what the BBBoC try to charge people.

Baker's involvement has riled them as much as anyone.
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presa
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« Reply #20 on: May 10, 2012, 09:33:14 AM »

this is not good at all.. why not just stage the fight in another country like spain or somewhere rather than get the boards back up?

even joe public know about this fiasco happening, not good for boxing.



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« Reply #21 on: May 10, 2012, 10:02:04 AM »

I broadly agree with what the BBBoC have said here, notwithstanding that I disagreed with their decision to ban Chisora indefinitely, without a term for automatic review.

The BBBoC has made some ill advised decisions as all governing bodies do.  But in this case, Chisora was still due to have his appeal heard as part of the due process.  Whilst there have been poor decisions from Board appointed officials in fights, shipping in random officials from Board's of random countries isn't going to rectify this.  Those involved in boxing matches under the auspices of the BBBoC are fighting in one of the safest environments in the boxing world as a result the improvements the Board have made. 

I can't think I've ever heard of a fighter from Luxembourg or a fight taking place there so who knows what their rules are regarding medical provision.

I never understood the mass hissy fit that followed what happened in Munich.  It was a post fight press conference, not on the stage at a The Wiggles show.  I imagine Chisora would have had his ban confirmed for a finite amount of time on appeal and Haye could have applied for a new British licence.

It does seem to smack of desperation somewhat that ***** would risk alienating the Board to such a degree in order to stage a one off event. 

Well made points as usual. I just think Wrren and the boxers are well within their rights to do this. The board is entangled in Bureaucracy and acts. They couldnt even give difined punishments. Apparently Del Boys June 2nd appeal was being put back till July due to Holidays too. So what real world options were there. It would have been a man banned for 6 months who still didnt know how long his ban was. Its a shambles.

The board invited this upon themselves through gutlessness and lack of intelligence.
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The Hurricane
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« Reply #22 on: May 10, 2012, 10:19:27 AM »

Well made points as usual. I just think Wrren and the boxers are well within their rights to do this. The board is entangled in Bureaucracy and acts. They couldnt even give difined punishments. Apparently Del Boys June 2nd appeal was being put back till July due to Holidays too. So what real world options were there. It would have been a man banned for 6 months who still didnt know how long his ban was. Its a shambles.

The board invited this upon themselves through gutlessness and lack of intelligence.

I agree that the Board really do need to have a look at themselves and how they conduct matters in the future after all of this.  There was of course the additional issue of the Board steward in Munich apparently being there under the banner of the WBC instead of representing Chisora which was a ridiculous situation.

The situation with Del is/was clearly unjust in my eyes and as you say, showed a lack of intelligence by the Board.  I'd have hoped that they'd have acted quickly to adopt a more judicious stance in how they were to deal with Chisora in light of the bans handed to Margarito, etc.

I can't help but keep thinking that two wrongs don't make a right though.  With what has been said about BN starting to charge a connection fee before this event, odds being offered on the fight not happening, etc something just doesn't sit right for me.  FW doesn't seem to be doing this out of a sense of injustice as to how Dereck has been treated by the Board, but for financial reasons that are being speculated upon.
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« Reply #23 on: May 10, 2012, 10:47:44 AM »

tbh, other than the medical side, fk the BBBoC

the fans govern the sport, if theres demand for it, a fight should happen. Any profitable organisation 'regulating' the thing they make money off can never be trusted to give completely objective, impartial governance.

They whined and withdrew chisoras licence intially because the media jumped all over it and were forced to do so. Now the fight is on legally and within the regulations they created but because theyre not getting a cut, they suddenly condemn it all.

I mean Honestly, do they expect the fans, joe public, the media to have any respect for the authority and reputation of the BBBoC over this matter when boxing is constantly getting dirtied by dodgey reffing, ludicrous judging and the like?

you cant ''regulate/oversee'' a fight that ends in a daylight robbery and is blatently corrupt and then pretend to be the whiter than white organisation grabbing the morale high ground over chisora-haye. They need to get their own order in check first before trying to sound off on their morale highhorse.

F*ck u BBBoC.
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''Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face'' - Mike Tyson
styledoctor
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« Reply #24 on: May 10, 2012, 12:01:08 PM »


We need to be careful what is wished for. Are the BBBofC perfect? Obviously not. Could they do with a rethink and/or long overdue revamp to get with the times? Yes absolutely. But in terms of world boxing credibility they are right up there. (I realise that's like saying they are the best goalkeeper in Scotland). As mentioned they have led the rest of the world in medical demands and routinely deny medically-questionable foreign fighters a licence when they have been fighting every month in continental Europe. They could be more open and transparent but referees and judges are answerable when they make mistakes like Mark Green and Ian John Lewis last year. I don't see how their actions regarding this farce have been comical. Haye is not a licence holder so they rightly stated they would not deal with him unless he reapplied for a licence - probably safe to assume he would have been denied for a period on the basis of bringing the sport into disrepute. They withdrew Chisora's without a specified time limit, and probably wanted to see signs of remorse or attempts to make some amends.

The statement the BBBofC produced yesterday was exactly what I wanted to see from them. A strong response which clearly states licences will deem to have been given up should licence holders take part in this show. Good for them. Yes they are self-preservationists but their role is to think about the long-term state of the sport in this country. I wonder what a certain promoter's stable would look like if you weren't eligible to fight for British, Area or Commonwealth titles? And you had to ply your trade abroad? It would be a stable of precisely zero fighters. If these are the stakes due to the Haye v Chisora fight, as already stated it would not come as a massive shock if Haye's back injury suddenly resurfaced leaving 25,000 people to watch Povetkin v Rahman then go home because there is no undercard apart from Johnathon Banks snoozing everyone to sleep with his past-it Michael Moorer impression.

Do we really want a free-for-all in this country, led by a certain promoter who regularly gets absolutely slated on here and most other forums? Who has thrown his toys out of the pram because the Board haven't pandered to his agenda, and had the appeal at a time which suited his plans. Because another few months might pass, by which time Haye v Chisora's business window of opportunity is now chip wrapper. Who do we trust with the administration of the sport as a whole? Surely not a bunch of suited spivs who have a suitcase full of cash and some photocopied Luxembourg licences? Do me a favour lads, whatever you think of the BBBofC, the alternatives are bad, bad, bad and the repurcussions will have us all slamming the keys on the keyboard so hard we will wish it was how it used to be.

I can just see it now. No Lonsdale belt, because kids in gyms across the country want the luminous plastic beaker you get for being Luxembourg Boxing Federation champion.
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Jambonhead
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« Reply #25 on: May 10, 2012, 12:28:14 PM »

tbh a lot of boxing fans disregard belts and as minor trinkets and the proper fans scrutinise a fighters record and form hard enough to judge a fighters credibility.

the only organisation i pay any attention to regarding rankings is the ring magazine, and even then its not gospel.

Ive given up trying to follow who the WBC rank no.2 is or the IBF champ is anymore, its all a load of bollocks. The real fans know who the real fighters are, and the critics/reputable organisations like the ring USUALLY back those fighters.

Belts mean jack, only legacy and fan base should determine fights
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« Reply #26 on: May 10, 2012, 12:40:34 PM »

Good post styledoctor.  Whilst I don't agree with certain of the Board's decisions in this episode I think it would be a dangerous folly for people to start advocating their rules be circumvented with impunity.  Globally, boxing is poorly regulated enough without the home of the sport becoming the wild west in terms of governance.  Although far from perfect, I still think the BBBoC have the interests of the sport at heart as opposed to the interests of their wallets as certain promoters may.

For me, the Lonsdale Belt is still one of the most prestigious in the world.  It would be a sorry state if it wasn't the dream of every kid in a British gym to one day wear it round their waist.

Jambon - The Ring are no where near reputable.  Look up their involvement with Don King in falsifying fighters records; and now they are a Golden Boy propaganda rag.  The Ring Belt has as much relevance as a Diamond Belt to me.
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styledoctor
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« Reply #27 on: May 10, 2012, 01:59:22 PM »

Good post styledoctor.  Whilst I don't agree with certain of the Board's decisions in this episode I think it would be a dangerous folly for people to start advocating their rules be circumvented with impunity.  Globally, boxing is poorly regulated enough without the home of the sport becoming the wild west in terms of governance.  Although far from perfect, I still think the BBBoC have the interests of the sport at heart as opposed to the interests of their wallets as certain promoters may.

For me, the Lonsdale Belt is still one of the most prestigious in the world.  It would be a sorry state if it wasn't the dream of every kid in a British gym to one day wear it round their waist.

Jambon - The Ring are no where near reputable.  Look up their involvement with Don King in falsifying fighters records; and now they are a Golden Boy propaganda rag.  The Ring Belt has as much relevance as a Diamond Belt to me.


Not sure if everyone's up to speed with how corrupt The Ring magazine has now become. They fired all the good writers and now this. What a horrific mess they have made of 'The Ring' belts. Cracking read on TSS website:

http://www.thesweetscience.com/news/articles/14560-occupy-the-ring

“We won’t get involved in the editorial side of rankings,” promised CEO Richard Schaefer when Golden Boy Enterprises purchased The Ring in 2007. Few believed him. I raised an eyebrow.

At the same time that Schaefer made one promise, Oscar De La Hoya made another. He said that Nigel Collins would stay in his position as editor-in-chief of the magazine. Last summer, Collins cleaned out his desk while De La Hoya cleaned house and moved The Ring from Blue Bell, Pennsylvania to his bathroom in Los Angeles.

One month later a newly-appointed editorial board pledged allegiance to the boss. After Bernard Hopkins lost his title by TKO to Chad Dawson, The Ring broke its own rules, fell in line with Schaefer, and declared that Hopkins was still the champion despite the referee’s call. The referee’s call was faulty and would later be overturned, but that isn’t the point. The point is that The Ring rushed to support a Golden Boy fighter when it would have been perfectly reasonable to wait for the official decision by the California State Athletic Commission.

I raised another eyebrow.

In January, the editorial board decided to remove number one-ranked Marco Huck from the cruiserweight rankings because of what turned out to be a single venture into the heavyweight realm. The next two ranked contenders were moved forward and fought for The Ring championship. This hasty move soon had the editors backpedaling faster than Joey Archer. This spring, Floyd Mayweather stepped up a weight class to challenge Miguel Cotto and was not removed from the welterweight ratings. Why? Editor-in-chief Michael Rosenthal stated the difference as one of “intentions.” In other words, had Huck won his heavyweight bout, he may have intended to leave the cruiserweight division “because he can make more money as a heavyweight.” But he didn’t and so returned to the cruiserweight division, which he also may have intended to do. The Ring “decided against dropping Mayweather because it is clear that he is a welterweight who took the fight with Cotto only because of economics.” In other words, “economics” was the magic bullet behind removing Huck and retaining Mayweather. Or was it simply that Mayweather, like Hopkins, is a Golden Boy fighter?

I don’t claim to know, but with no more eyebrows to raise it was time to take action. 

Some weeks ago, I contacted a member of The Ring Ratings Panel for reassurance. I got that and an invitation to join the panel and see for myself. So I did.

Nineteen days later I resigned.

The reason I did is that the editorial board, unbeknownst to the ratings panel, reworked The Ring’s championship policy and effectively destroyed its purpose and credibility. [See below] 

___________________________________________

NEW CHAMPIONSHIP POLICY

Championship vacancies can be filled in the following two ways:

 1. THE RING’s Nos. 1 and 2 contenders fight one another.

2. If the Nos. 1 and 2 contenders choose not to fight one another and either of them fights No. 3, No. 4 or No. 5, the winner may be awarded THE RING belt.

 

CHAMPIONSHIP RETENTION

THE RING also wants to encourage its champions to face worthy opponents. With that in mind, here are the six situations in which a champion may lose his belt:

 1. The Champion loses a fight in the weight class in which he is champion.

2. The Champion moves to another weight class.

3. The Champion does not schedule a fight in any weight class for 18 months.

4. The Champion does not schedule a fight at his championship weight for 18 months (even if he fights at another weight).

5. The Champion does not schedule a fight with a Top-5 contender from any weight class for two years.

6. The Champion retires.

___________________________________________

The crux of the problem is highlighted in red. The disaster it invites need not be highlighted beyond a glance back at trampled history:

In 1922, the magazine began awarding its tri-colored championship belt to deserving fighters. This continued for nearly 70 years. In 2002, it inaugurated a strict championship policy that offered clarity in the era of alphabet titlists.

On May 3rd, a full ninety years after Nat Fleischer handed The Ring’s belt to Jack Dempsey; his revered magazine was taken for a joy ride over a cliff. It landed in the hot mess of alphabet soup. The new championship policy is absurd enough to allow second-ranked Floyd Mayweather to face fifth-ranked Kell Brook in the fall and thus become The Ring’s welterweight champion. This doesn’t just enable avoidance-prone fighters like Floyd (who is at least half the reason why the most anticipated match-up of the last 25 years isn’t happening); it adds to the confusion.

In decrying what they claim as too many vacant championships, the editorial board defends the change with what sounds like a text between network executives and Jose Sulaiman: “We decided to update our Championship Policy,” Rosenthal wrote, “to encourage top fighters to face one another and create more championship fights.” More championship fights? How about real championship fights?

There were actually more vacancies when Nigel Collins instituted the original policy; though he considered it the lesser evil. “While having 13 of 17 world championships vacant is hardly an ideal situation,” he asserted, “it is far better than having a collection of counterfeit claimants muddling the championship picture.” He was right.

The Ring also announced its intention to strip its champions under certain conditions. This is another stunning about-face. “It is extremely important to keep in mind,” Collins warned in 2002, “that the bedrock of The Ring’s philosophy is that titles can only be won or lost in the ring.” So much for that. 

Members of The Ring Ratings Panel are resigning. Respected boxing writers are withdrawing recognition of its ratings. Fans are cancelling their subscriptions in protest. After 90 years, the final bell seems to be ringing for The Ring ...soon to be known as the WRING. 

Many fans saw this coming. The truest among them stand in a fighter’s stance —with one foot behind, ready for whatever. Boxing history has been battered by golden era racketeers who hid behind front men and continues to reel under new ones hiding behind acronyms; but what happened last week isn’t just another shiner. It’s compromising our vision. 

A CLARION CALL                                                                                                         

Disorganization and the greed that thrives on that disorganization have reduced the oldest and greatest sport to niche status. The fact that it is still capable of filling arenas and commanding record-breaking pay-per-view numbers is a minor miracle. It testifies to how well boxing captures the human spirit and how much we yearn for demonstrations of that spirit. In the aftermath of dramatic fights, we bask in vicarious glory and forget that we deserve more of them.

We are boxing’s 99%. We are also its financiers. Reforming boxing begins with understanding both the power of that fact and the economics of that fact. It requires action. The sport is simple in its form. Its reform can be just as simple:

1. The true champion of every weight division must be identifiable. Before that can happen an objective rankings panel must be instituted that is internationally represented, knowledgeable, and independent —free and clear from any involvement with promoters and the so-called sanctioning bodies.

2. Disempowering those responsible for creating the confusion in which they alone thrive is a duty for everyone who loves the Sweet Science. It begins with language: Boxing writers support racketeers every time a three-letter acronym appears in their articles. Boxing commentators support racketeers every time a three-letter acronym appears on air. Both should stop mentioning even the status of a fighter as “belt-holder,” “titlist,” etc. Uncrowned boxers are contenders; their status will be determined in the rank accorded them by the international rankings panel. If we want to make boxing great again, we need to stop lying. We need to insist that a “world championship match” is exactly what it professes to be. Eventually, the fighters will realize the worthlessness of those belts and aspire to the only title worthy of our collective attention. The networks will fall in line.

3. Reform requires vigilance. Fans have real power at their fingertips; why not aim it at media figures who make a habit of acknowledging acronyms or for that matter, anyone harming the integrity of pure combat for profit or personal motive? Boxing needs watchdogs. Sign up.

If boxing’s 99% —the media and fans— support the idea of one clean system that ranks contenders and identifies the true champions, the scales will tip away from the pimps and toward the public. New initiatives can be instituted to sweep out the refuse and safeguard the majesty of the ring. These initiatives may include the following:

a. First-ranked contenders must fight second-ranked contenders to fill vacant world championships. Contenders further down the ladder do not constitute the best, and with battles royal on the ash heap of history, why include them? In the event that the first two ranked contenders are unwilling to fight for whatever reason, the rankings panel can conduct an investigation in an effort to uncover which one is 51% or more at fault. That contender risks demotion in the rankings due to his “questionable fighting spirit.” No longer will allowances for third, fourth, and fifth-ranked contenders be warranted once avoidance is unmasked and penalized.

b. Any card on any network that makes a false claim to be a championship bout invites a boycott. Tweet that.

c. True champions will be strongly encouraged to demonstrate their authenticity by publically rejecting make-pretend titles once and for all. 

If we’ve learned nothing else in the past few years, we’ve learned first-hand the perils of allowing self-interest to run amok in the market place. There is something bigger than currency at stake here. The alphabet boys will never understand it and The Ring forgot which side it’s on, but there are others in the red light district of sports —in press row, in the cheap seats— who have it wrapped up in fists. Their power is yet unrealized.

Today, boxing writers, bloggers, commentators, and fans mime a ten count over a magazine that landed a left hook on itself. We’re good at that.

We need to do more.
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Jambonhead
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« Reply #28 on: May 10, 2012, 04:11:48 PM »

Good post styledoctor.  Whilst I don't agree with certain of the Board's decisions in this episode I think it would be a dangerous folly for people to start advocating their rules be circumvented with impunity.  Globally, boxing is poorly regulated enough without the home of the sport becoming the wild west in terms of governance.  Although far from perfect, I still think the BBBoC have the interests of the sport at heart as opposed to the interests of their wallets as certain promoters may.

For me, the Lonsdale Belt is still one of the most prestigious in the world.  It would be a sorry state if it wasn't the dream of every kid in a British gym to one day wear it round their waist.

Jambon - The Ring are no where near reputable.  Look up their involvement with Don King in falsifying fighters records; and now they are a Golden Boy propaganda rag.  The Ring Belt has as much relevance as a Diamond Belt to me.

im not saying theyre the gospel. just they are more impartial than any other organisation....which really isnt saying much. I use their rankings more as a rough guide and agree with the majority of their calls, except their top 10 p4p which is a mess atm. And lately the rankings have become a bit sloppy
« Last Edit: May 10, 2012, 04:16:28 PM by Jambonhead » Logged

Bunce-''right Im not sure whats going with the walk ins so lets just listen to some mariachi music and look at the corona girls''

''Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face'' - Mike Tyson
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