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May 25, 2013, 04:38:18 PM*

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Author Topic: Cameron to tear up uk benefits system  (Read 1087 times)
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hoover
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« Reply #30 on: June 25, 2012, 07:13:33 PM »

Define rich please





Good point, I used the term very generally, I imagine the average earner would define someone on 60K as rich, I don't myself, I would define someone who has a couple of million as rich, any less than that then realistically to enjoy any level of extravagant life style they would need to work.

How would you define rich?
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LiveFight
« Reply #30 on: June 25, 2012, 07:13:33 PM »

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7777
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« Reply #31 on: June 25, 2012, 07:22:38 PM »

Sticky toffee pudding with brandy butter.
[/quote

Figured

So....

What about people paying 40% tax rate for being successful / hard working?
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jimjack
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« Reply #32 on: June 25, 2012, 07:25:08 PM »

Rich could be defined by earnings, assets or disposable income. The truth is all should be taken into consideration and that makes any true definition impossible.
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hoover
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« Reply #33 on: June 25, 2012, 07:28:56 PM »

Sticky toffee pudding with brandy butter.
[/quote

Figured

So....

What about people paying 40% tax rate for being successful / hard working?

40% in my opinion is a lot, I have been in the 40% bracket for 15 years and I have kind of just got used to it, the 45-50% brackets are quite simply a Piss take in my opinion, there should be a cut off on income tax, if you have worker hard and got into the £150, 000  earnings bracket it is madness to imagine that you should pay 50p in every pound to the tax man
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7777
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« Reply #34 on: June 25, 2012, 07:38:35 PM »

Tax is a f***ing killer. I get hammered and it pisses me off because I have worked f***ing hard to get a good job and never sponged on ANY Government, does my head in that those more successful / hard working suffer

I know people think we're paying for Jimmy Carr but I honestly see Jimmy Carr getting nailed and think fair f***ing play. It's the system he has swerved and it's the systems fault. Simple.

I do actually have a job for those doubters #scouse!  Cheesy
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hoover
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« Reply #35 on: June 25, 2012, 07:43:48 PM »

Tax is a f***ing killer. I get hammered and it pisses me off because I have worked f***ing hard to get a good job and never sponged on ANY Government, does my head in that those more successful / hard working suffer

I know people think we're paying for Jimmy Carr but I honestly see Jimmy Carr getting nailed and think fair f***ing play. It's the system he has swerved and it's the systems fault. Simple.

I do actually have a job for those doubters #scouse!  Cheesy

What I would love to know is how much Jimmy Carr has actually paid, the media want to slate him for paying less and saying he is morally wrong, he is not morally wrong he was tax efficient, nothing immoral there, I would dearly love to know the actual number
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« Reply #36 on: June 25, 2012, 08:00:07 PM »

What I would love to know is how much Jimmy Carr has actually paid, the media want to slate him for paying less and saying he is morally wrong, he is not morally wrong he was tax efficient, nothing immoral there, I would dearly love to know the actual number


I would too but ultimately it doesn't matter, he blagged it and good for him  Smiley
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hoover
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« Reply #37 on: June 25, 2012, 08:01:40 PM »

I would too but ultimately it doesn't matter, he blagged it and good for him  Smiley

He was efficient and I agree
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johnymac
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« Reply #38 on: June 25, 2012, 08:56:22 PM »

SO you want people on the dole to pay there way but for the rich its ok not to ?

Jimmy carr will of paid tax on about 11k gross. Im not sure how much he has earned each year but the estimated he has 3million.
if he paid tax of say 2k 7777s and you paid say 6k on 35 your ok with . Or worse still earn 60 and pa around 22k to his 2k.

Its not even clever its just they do they own tax return so arent taxed at source , then alls you need it money ...100k is a start have 200k -400k in a business avaliable and its childsplay its set up for us to use . its not something we made ourselves. And i still have no idea why its legal , never mind the fact it ever was in the first place.

I loan you money you pay me back out your wages but go into your boss and say but i paid someone my wages why should i pay tax. He will say its the law
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hoover
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« Reply #39 on: June 25, 2012, 09:09:31 PM »

SO you want people on the dole to pay there way but for the rich its ok not to ?

Jimmy carr will of paid tax on about 11k gross. Im not sure how much he has earned each year but the estimated he has 3million.
if he paid tax of say 2k 7777s and you paid say 6k on 35 your ok with . Or worse still earn 60 and pa around 22k to his 2k.

Its not even clever its just they do they own tax return so arent taxed at source , then alls you need it money ...100k is a start have 200k -400k in a business avaliable and its childsplay its set up for us to use . its not something we made ourselves. And i still have no idea why its legal , never mind the fact it ever was in the first place.

I loan you money you pay me back out your wages but go into your boss and say but i paid someone my wages why should i pay tax. He will say its the law

Again you are making assumptions with no grounds of proof, you don't actually know how much tax he did or didn't pay, I would reserve judgement until we know the facts
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Tito
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« Reply #40 on: June 25, 2012, 10:50:09 PM »

It as been said last week Carr was only paying 1% tax on his earnings last year in which he earned £3.3 million. At the end of the day he as used a clever accountant and got away with paying his fair share but why are these loopholes allowed and why are there so many ways to cream of money in scams designed to avoid tax.
Lord Ashcroft a Tory Donor as all his money and companies registered in Belize was it right he got a peerage. Zac Goldsmith a Tory MP was a non dorm paying a fraction of tax on his inheritence and earnings which ran into hundreds of millions. I'm sure there are MP's across all parties, Business Men and people within sport and entertainment that refuse to pay the going rate and that is where the hypocrisy is when Cameron starts off in public slagging one but not the other.
David Cameron is a good talker but he is a man who as had nothing but wealth, privlege and his father's contacts to get him a head start in life. He is so out of touch its unreal and the public aren't fooled that we are all in this together as he claims. He as had more Holidays than Judith Chalmers whilst being PM and had to be coaxed back whilst London and half the country was rioting last summer. He as said he will stop internships for people with family contacts and let the best candidate get a job but him and Osborne both benefitted through that. They both also got safe Tory seats without gaining a constituancy that they took from another party he is just a wolf in sheeps clothes telling us how we should live our lives whilst quaffing Champagne with the chipping norton set leaving the kids in the pub whilst he dreams up another way to shit on the working classes.
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johnymac
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« Reply #41 on: June 25, 2012, 11:03:44 PM »

.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2012, 11:42:11 PM by johnymac » Logged
johnymac
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« Reply #42 on: June 25, 2012, 11:14:49 PM »

Spot on mate
It as been said last week Carr was only paying 1% tax on his earnings last year in which he earned £3.3 million. At the end of the day he as used a clever accountant and got away with paying his fair share but why are these loopholes allowed and why are there so many ways to cream of money in scams designed to avoid tax.
Lord Ashcroft a Tory Donor as all his money and companies registered in Belize was it right he got a peerage. Zac Goldsmith a Tory MP was a non dorm paying a fraction of tax on his inheritence and earnings which ran into hundreds of millions. I'm sure there are MP's across all parties, Business Men and people within sport and entertainment that refuse to pay the going rate and that is where the hypocrisy is when Cameron starts off in public slagging one but not the other.
David Cameron is a good talker but he is a man who as had nothing but wealth, privlege and his father's contacts to get him a head start in life. He is so out of touch its unreal and the public aren't fooled that we are all in this together as he claims. He as had more Holidays than Judith Chalmers whilst being PM and had to be coaxed back whilst London and half the country was rioting last summer. He as said he will stop internships for people with family contacts and let the best candidate get a job but him and Osborne both benefitted through that. They both also got safe Tory seats without gaining a constituancy that they took from another party he is just a wolf in sheeps clothes telling us how we should live our lives whilst quaffing Champagne with the chipping norton set leaving the kids in the pub whilst he dreams up another way to shit on the working classes.
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Tito
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« Reply #43 on: June 25, 2012, 11:40:43 PM »

Rather than supposition, do you have any idea what Branson pays in tax?

Its almost impossible to calculate what he payes in taxes as all of his business are spread in offshore companies with different levys of tax.
But this little piece in the Mail pretty much sums up the type of character he really is.

The Virgin tycoon's first business venture, in 1969, was Student magazine, sold from a basement off London's Edgware Road, and his next was selling records from a warehouse in Paddington.Both enterprises were tinged by sharp practices, especially Virgin Records. Based on cheating the Customs & Excise of tax on the sale of records, Branson chortled that the fraud was "a great wheeze".
Eventually he was fined £20,000 and paid £40,000 in taxes, the equivalent today of nearly £1million. That crime could be ignored as a youthful excess if Branson had not perpetuated another unethical ruse in 1988.
On that occasion, being depressed by the poor performance of Virgin Music on the stock market and having sold shares to the public at 140p, he wanted to buy them back for the same price, valuing the company at £248m.
Reluctantly, the shareholders agreed, although they were unaware that Branson had already agreed to sell the same shares to Pony Canyon, a Japanese media company, for £377m - that's £129m more than he told his shareholders the company was worth.
That dishonesty was eventually revealed in 2000 when Branson was on the verge of winning the franchise for the National Lottery from Camelot.
It was his second such attempt, but his bid became mired in a dispute with the Lottery regulator, Lord Burns (a hugely respected former permanent secretary at the Treasury).
Lord Burns advised that Branson's past business record rendered him unsuitable to be trusted to manage the Lottery's billions. So ended what Branson called "the most important thing in my life".
As a brilliant salesman and unique self-publicist, Branson can be forgiven for hyping his products' successes and smudging discomforting truths. Yet he often teeters on the edge of making fraudulent claims.
For example, during his launch of Virgin Cola in 1995, he claimed that his new drink had 10 per cent of the market, while, in truth, it had fallen to just 3.3 pc.
"We're earning £1m profits a week from Virgin Cola," Branson claimed.
However, insiders knew the business was actually losing money and was worth a fraction of his assessment.
Branson might claim his optimism was innocent, but others would say that if public money was at stake - as with Northern Rock - such false assertions would be reckless.
Public investors did indeed risk their money in Branson's ventures involving clothes, cosmetics and a Belgian-based airline, Virgin Express. In all three companies, the original investors lost money.
Today, in another area of his wide-ranging business portfolio, those investors who put money into Virgin Media (now haemorrhaging viewers to archrival BSkyB) and Virgin Mobile USA at the outset are now losing money.
Private investors have also lost by tying themselves to Branson. In 1999, Singapore Airlines bought a 49 pc stake in Virgin Atlantic, based on its value of £1.2 billion.
The airline is now valued at about £750 m and Singapore Airlines wants to sell its stake. Like his partners in Virgin Blue, a low-cost airline in Australia, the Singaporeans have not enjoyed their relationship with Branson.
But, more importantly, the biggest loser to date in Branson's enterprises has been the British taxpayer - especially due to his involvement in the privatisation of British Rail.
In the early Nineties, Branson pledged he could run an efficient rail franchise and make it profitable within five years.
As a result, Virgin Rail won the lucrative West Coast franchise on the basis of a deal in which it received a £77m subsidy from the Government and would then pay back a licence fee to run the line from the anticipated profits.
Branson promised that within two years, his service would provide "hand-held TV sets, low-cost phone reservations and more staff".
Students and groups would be offered "deeply discounted fares".
However, Branson has failed to transform the West Coast line, with millions of passengers suffering delays while taxpayers have been forced to fork out more money in subsidies.
The fact is that behind the cheeky, blokey persona lies Branson's raw pursuit of money, power and influence


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Tito
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« Reply #44 on: June 25, 2012, 11:47:36 PM »

One other thing I found out about Branson is that if he liquadated all his assets and retired to Necker Island he would not be eligable to pay a single penny to the Treasury in tax due to how he as shaped his business affairs with his £3 billion pound fortune.
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